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Assisted dying bill: Special series #12 - Parliament Matters podcast, Episode 93

17 May 2025
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Is Kim Leadbeater's Assisted Dying Bill now "over the hump?" The Bill's supporters got it though its first day of Report Stage consideration in the House of Commons unscathed, with comfortable majorities in every vote. So, with debate on the most contentious set of amendments disposed of, will it now coast through its remaining scrutiny days in the Commons?

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Ruth and Mark, joined by procedural guru and former Commons Clerk Paul Evans, break down the tactical landscape and recap how the debate unfolded. They also assess the Speaker’s pivotal decisions that shaped the debate – awarding points for both artistic impression and technical merit.

With the bill set to return to the Commons to complete Report Stage on the next Private Members Bill Friday, on 13 June, they suggest that the biggest remaining obstacle is the next "in principle" vote, at the end of the Third Reading debate.

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Our guest

Paul Evans CBE. ©

Paul Evans CBE

Paul worked as a Clerk in the House of Commons for nearly forty years, retiring in 2019 as Clerk of Committees responsible for the House’s select committees. He was made a CBE in 2019 for services to Parliament. During his career in the House of Commons he held a number of posts including Clerk of the Journals and Principal Clerk of the Table Office. He is a member of the Hansard Society and is a former Chair of the Study of Parliament Group . He has published a number of works on Parliament including the Dods Handbook of House of Commons Procedure.

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Please note, this transcript is automatically generated. There may consequently be minor errors and the text is not formatted according to our style guide. If you wish to reference or cite the transcript copy below, please first check against the audio version above.

supported by the Joseph Rowntree Charitable Trust. Learn more at hansardsociety.org.uk/pm.

Ruth Fox: Welcome to Parliament Matters, the podcast about the institution at the heart of our democracy, Parliament itself. I'm Ruth Fox.

Mark D'Arcy: And I'm Mark D'Arcy. And welcome to the latest in our special series of podcasts, tracing the progress of the Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill, the bill that will enable assisted dying in England and Wales.

And we're recording just hours after the latest section of debate on the bill. The first day of its report stage consideration has ended, with some people who support the bill saying that they're now over the hump. The most difficult section of debate has now been dealt with, even if a few of the votes haven't yet happened.

Ruth Fox: Yes, Mark, [00:01:00] it was, well, it was a techier than, certainly the second reading, and some of what we saw in public bill committee. It was quite a difficult debate at times and a sense that a few people were quite close to losing their temper and some others quite emotional.

Mark D'Arcy: Yeah, indeed it was, a different tone of debate.

They said after the second reading debate, this is parliament at its best, which is the MP's sort of backslapping self congratulation of it. We've all been polite to one another today. This was not so polite. There was definitely more kind of subliminal suggestion of bad faith from the other side. Coming from both sides of the debate. And a certain amount of nastiness and just a tinge of procedural gameplay as well. You know, divisions were forced and then went on longer than usual and

Ruth Fox: A bit of foot dragging in the division lobbies.

Mark D'Arcy: Foot dragging in the division lobbies. The kind of old school time wasting tactics that I used to spend many a long Private Members Bill Friday watching in my Today In Parliament days, and here we are again with the same old games being played.

Ruth Fox: Yeah, and I think the Sergeant at Arms was sent out into the [00:02:00] division lobby, I think a couple of times to find out what was going on.

Mark D'Arcy: It wasn't allowed to drag on too long.

Mr. Speaker Hoyle was pretty diligent in making sure that after 15 minutes had elapsed, you know, he'd make sure that they weren't gonna let it drag on.

Ruth Fox: Yeah, yeah.

Mark D'Arcy: So he didn't indulge the game playing.

Ruth Fox: Yeah. No, it was a very different tone of the debate, I have to say. I don't think Esther Rantzen has helped.

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